The following is from the CONLANG list. (I hope Amanda doesn't mind being quoted here.) I was pretty happy about this translation for a few reasons. The first is that it plugged a couple of glaring holes in my vocabulary ("cook" and "enjoy").
As I was looking through the words I do have, I found "fire (n), burn (v)" and related words, and also "warm (n, v)", but decided to go with something completely different for "cook". It gives me something else to build new words with. (For instance, "pwenulam" (fire+cook) could be used for grilling or barbecuing.)
Anyway, here's the post with the quoted part in italics and my response in bold:
On 3/12/2011 10:50 PM, Amanda Babcock Furrow wrote:
> I've been meaning to put out this translation exercise ever since Penzey's
> sent my husband the bumper sticker he couldn't resist "fixing" - from
> "Love people. Cook them tasty food." to "Love people. Cook them. Tasty!
> Food!"
>
> So, the exercise is: show us how different these two sentences are IYCL!
>
In Teliya Nevashi:
Hulishi jenenam. Ulamishi nashiyam anási vonesh.
Like(neighborly love)-IMP people-ACC. Cook-IMP food-ACC delicious them-DAT.
Jemishi jenenam. Ulamishi vonet. Anási! Nashiya!
Enjoy-IMP people-ACC. Cook-IMP them-ACC. Delicious! Food!
I was really torn about whether or not to use the imperative here, since
I also have an optative (which would suggest that it is desirable to do
these things) and a couple of varieties of 'should' that vary by the
degree of obligation (or the degree to which you'd feel guilty if you
didn't). In the end, I think I am happy with the way it turned out. And
they are pretty fun to read aloud too. (And I do need the practice
speaking the language aloud.)
Tuesday, March 15, 2011
Thursday, January 27, 2011
Update. No New Content Today... Yet.
I received a Kindle for Christmas from my son and his wife. (Actually, I am pretty sure that it was mostly from my daughter-in-law. She's sweet like that.) I am excited about the prospect of getting the grammar of TN into a Kindle-friendly format so that I can have an easily portable reference.
I need to update the grammar, and then I might create a "cheat sheet" version for the Kindle.
This afternoon, I plan on working out a simple Teliya Nevashi phrase book in order to have some useful conversational items together in one place.
I've been having a strong urge to start a new conlang, one that has the explicit purpose of being a personal auxiliary language (i.e. a conlang designed for everyday use in the real world by me... and anyone else interested). All my languages have this purpose, to some extent, but this is what I've been thinking about specifically for a new conlang now.
I'll try to resist, planning to redirect that energy toward TN, but I am not making any promises.
I need to update the grammar, and then I might create a "cheat sheet" version for the Kindle.
This afternoon, I plan on working out a simple Teliya Nevashi phrase book in order to have some useful conversational items together in one place.
I've been having a strong urge to start a new conlang, one that has the explicit purpose of being a personal auxiliary language (i.e. a conlang designed for everyday use in the real world by me... and anyone else interested). All my languages have this purpose, to some extent, but this is what I've been thinking about specifically for a new conlang now.
I'll try to resist, planning to redirect that energy toward TN, but I am not making any promises.
Monday, January 3, 2011
The Fourth Annual State Of The Language
Happy New Year! Welcome to 2011!
Let's get right into this, shall we?
This year was another slow one for TN. I've actually spent a lot of time thinking about it, but not very much time actually writing those thoughts down. I feel like my current documentation of the grammar is really out-of-date and in need of revision, but still usable, if not particularly user friendly. The vocabulary continues to grow. It is up to almost 450 words, although this total number also counts alternate forms of the same word and words derived from other words. But, hey, I never turn down a good number!
I have come to the conclusion that I need to approach the language differently. Neglecting it really isn't doing much to improve it.
This is going to be the year of translations and composition for TN-- to work out the bugs in the grammar, expand the lexicon, and get myself a lot more comfortable with using it. I had wanted to post some audio files in 2010, but that idea fell through the cracks. This year, I am going to make some recordings, and hopefully have some other people make recordings as well. I predict some fairly major revisions coming to the grammar, and possibly to the phonology as well, as the language gets used more on paper and aloud.
I realize that this is pretty much exactly what I said last year, but it didn't pan out in reality, and it all still needs to happen if the language is going to get up off the paper and get some life into it, if you know what I mean.
On a completly trivial note, this blog (which is also the "official site" for the language) is getting a new look. I am tired of the old one, and the light green on dark green has been getting a little hard on my eyes.
And that's pretty much all I have to say about where TN is at and where it is going. Now it is time for me to go take a nice hot bath as a reward for getting in here for the fourth year in a row to post a "State of the Language". And on time, too!
Let's get right into this, shall we?
This year was another slow one for TN. I've actually spent a lot of time thinking about it, but not very much time actually writing those thoughts down. I feel like my current documentation of the grammar is really out-of-date and in need of revision, but still usable, if not particularly user friendly. The vocabulary continues to grow. It is up to almost 450 words, although this total number also counts alternate forms of the same word and words derived from other words. But, hey, I never turn down a good number!
I have come to the conclusion that I need to approach the language differently. Neglecting it really isn't doing much to improve it.
This is going to be the year of translations and composition for TN-- to work out the bugs in the grammar, expand the lexicon, and get myself a lot more comfortable with using it. I had wanted to post some audio files in 2010, but that idea fell through the cracks. This year, I am going to make some recordings, and hopefully have some other people make recordings as well. I predict some fairly major revisions coming to the grammar, and possibly to the phonology as well, as the language gets used more on paper and aloud.
I realize that this is pretty much exactly what I said last year, but it didn't pan out in reality, and it all still needs to happen if the language is going to get up off the paper and get some life into it, if you know what I mean.
On a completly trivial note, this blog (which is also the "official site" for the language) is getting a new look. I am tired of the old one, and the light green on dark green has been getting a little hard on my eyes.
And that's pretty much all I have to say about where TN is at and where it is going. Now it is time for me to go take a nice hot bath as a reward for getting in here for the fourth year in a row to post a "State of the Language". And on time, too!
Nashvi: A Vocabulary Installment
I have had this stuck among my draft posts for a while, so now I am winding it up and posting it. I have spent an inordinate amount of time thinking about the Nevashi words for flatware (nashvi), mainly because I think of the words I want to use when I am walking to the store or in the shower or washing dishes, and then I forget them before I get a chance to write them down, so I have to invent them all over again later.
keb, to cut, slice
kebvi or kevvi, knife, blade
kebviozh or kevviozh, dagger, sword, machete (Anything in the large-to-very-large blade category)
vankebvi or vankevvi, scissors
The two forms shown are a matter of indecision on my part. It's my gut feeling that the 'bv' in this combination would eventually become 'vv', but I haven't decided if it is really going to do that at all, or if it would be spelled kebvi and pronounced kevvi, or be both spelled and pronounced kevvi. I haven't decided if this is some sort of general rule that might apply to other cases (e.g. would a hypothetical word kekxi become kexxi also?), if it is specific to that affix, or if it is sort of a weird thing about words for cutting-related tools. I haven't even formulated what the rule might be. That's something bubbling away on the back burner.
mek, to skewer or impale
meknash, fork
mekvi, skewer, spear
tum, to shovel or spoon (lift and move or measure with a shovel or spoon)
tumvi, shovel
tumviet, spoon
erhush, stir, mix together
luca, plate, disc
svado, bowl, dish
kalo, cooking pot, pan
iozina (or, alternately/more properly, iotzina), table (or board or plank; literally, "flat wood")
When I went to add these to the lexicon file, I found that I already had a word for "dish, bowl" (svado), which left kalo an orphan, so now it means a pan or pot for cooking. I was going to use it for table, but it sounded more bowl-shaped to me, so I decided to go the board=table route for table. I had to make a word for "wood" and then "flatwood" (because that sounded better than "cutwood" when I looked at both) and (SHAZAM!) we have a word for table.
keb, to cut, slice
kebvi or kevvi, knife, blade
kebviozh or kevviozh, dagger, sword, machete (Anything in the large-to-very-large blade category)
vankebvi or vankevvi, scissors
The two forms shown are a matter of indecision on my part. It's my gut feeling that the 'bv' in this combination would eventually become 'vv', but I haven't decided if it is really going to do that at all, or if it would be spelled kebvi and pronounced kevvi, or be both spelled and pronounced kevvi. I haven't decided if this is some sort of general rule that might apply to other cases (e.g. would a hypothetical word kekxi become kexxi also?), if it is specific to that affix, or if it is sort of a weird thing about words for cutting-related tools. I haven't even formulated what the rule might be. That's something bubbling away on the back burner.
mek, to skewer or impale
meknash, fork
mekvi, skewer, spear
tum, to shovel or spoon (lift and move or measure with a shovel or spoon)
tumvi, shovel
tumviet, spoon
erhush, stir, mix together
luca, plate, disc
svado, bowl, dish
kalo, cooking pot, pan
iozina (or, alternately/more properly, iotzina), table (or board or plank; literally, "flat wood")
When I went to add these to the lexicon file, I found that I already had a word for "dish, bowl" (svado), which left kalo an orphan, so now it means a pan or pot for cooking. I was going to use it for table, but it sounded more bowl-shaped to me, so I decided to go the board=table route for table. I had to make a word for "wood" and then "flatwood" (because that sounded better than "cutwood" when I looked at both) and (SHAZAM!) we have a word for table.
Thursday, May 13, 2010
Ohazishi ath vensháo
It's very late. I am very tired. This is not enough to keep me from posting here, is it?
There was a much earlier entry about greetings, but it failed to have some common expressions like "Good morning" and "Good night". I am ready to tackle those now. Here's one:
Ohazishi ath vensháo ("Keep yourself safe tonight") -- This is a departure version of "Good night". It's just what they'd say. It might even be what you'd say to someone going to bed, but I will have to think on that more when I am more awake.
I am going to bed now. Ca mer noa.
Ohazishi ath vensháo
There was a much earlier entry about greetings, but it failed to have some common expressions like "Good morning" and "Good night". I am ready to tackle those now. Here's one:
Ohazishi ath vensháo ("Keep yourself safe tonight") -- This is a departure version of "Good night". It's just what they'd say. It might even be what you'd say to someone going to bed, but I will have to think on that more when I am more awake.
I am going to bed now. Ca mer noa.
Ohazishi ath vensháo
Tuesday, May 11, 2010
Hrmph
In the previous entry, I'd translated the first 28 lines of McGuffey's First Reader. I had started working on more, but nothing is ready to post yet. Instead, I will address a problem in what I've already done.
13.Fwipi sul ya tase ya valtem adadi.
This is supposed to mean:
The man can see the boy run.
Adadi would be a adjective out of the verb, "adad". I was thinking at the time that it would be something like a present participle in English and that ya valtem adadi would mean "the running boy" which would seem close enough. It's not right though. It doesn't mean that he's running now, but that he's a boy who runs a lot, runs habitually, or likes running, something like that.
Let's have another go at it...
Fwipi sul ya tase ya valtem kwe ki adad lia.
potential-nonpast-3rd-sing-(perceive) see the man the boy (acc) that(relative clause opener) nonpast-3rd-sing run (relative clause closer).
The man can see the boy that runs/is running.
I think that's close enough.
In a later edit:
On the other hand, I could just let "adadi" mean what I intended in translation *and* also have those other meanings as well. Now that I am giving it a second thought, I think I'll just leave it as is.
(So now you get to see some of my process in action. Things change, change back, and then change again all the time.)
13.Fwipi sul ya tase ya valtem adadi.
This is supposed to mean:
The man can see the boy run.
Adadi would be a adjective out of the verb, "adad". I was thinking at the time that it would be something like a present participle in English and that ya valtem adadi would mean "the running boy" which would seem close enough. It's not right though. It doesn't mean that he's running now, but that he's a boy who runs a lot, runs habitually, or likes running, something like that.
Let's have another go at it...
Fwipi sul ya tase ya valtem kwe ki adad lia.
potential-nonpast-3rd-sing-(perceive) see the man the boy (acc) that(relative clause opener) nonpast-3rd-sing run (relative clause closer).
The man can see the boy that runs/is running.
I think that's close enough.
In a later edit:
On the other hand, I could just let "adadi" mean what I intended in translation *and* also have those other meanings as well. Now that I am giving it a second thought, I think I'll just leave it as is.
(So now you get to see some of my process in action. Things change, change back, and then change again all the time.)
Monday, April 19, 2010
McGuffey's First Reader Translation
Gary Shannon recently posted that he was going to translate McGuffey's First Reader as a method of language construction. I decided to apply Teliya Nevashi to the same text.
I haven't checked these over, but here we go:
1. Ca sul levtem. (The boy and girl in the illustration looked like they were probably in that 5-12 year old range.)
2. Ca sul levtam.
3. Ca sul levtem wa levtam.
4. Fwici sul ya levte ya levtam.
5. Fwaca sul ya levtam wa ya levtem.
6. Fwaca sul ya levtam.
7. Sulishi ya tasem!
8. Sulishi ya valtem wa ya tasem. (The boy in the illustration looked like a teen to me.)
9. Pi def ya tase cakom.
10. Pi def ya valte cakom, pi seya?
11. Fwiki adad ya valte.
12. Fwiki adad ya tase, ki?
13. Fwipi sul ya tase ya valtem adadi.
14. Pa def cakom.
15. Pa def voyabenam.
16. Sulishi voyabenam laz!
17. Fwici sul voyabena, ci seya?
18. Fwaca sul voyabenam laz.
19. Pi def ya voyabena cakom, pi seya?
20. Pi def voyabena laz cakom. (Alternately, Pi def laz voyabena cakom. OR Pi def ya voyabena laz cakom.)
21. Pi def levta voyabenam wa cakom.
22. Fwiki lon ya levte, ki?
23. Fwiki lon wa adad ya levte.
24. Fwiki lon ya levte lonosham ulai.
25. Fwiki lon ya tase lonosham ulai, ki seya?
26. Fwipi sul ya tase ya levtem loni.
27. Fwipi weyat ya tase ya ulam, pi?
28. Fwipi weyat ya levte ya ulam.
That was fun. I might do more in a few more days. Or months. You know how it goes around here.
And a special request translation: Mi gan sanzomo laz go ambo-ambo. My canoe is very large.
I haven't checked these over, but here we go:
1. Ca sul levtem. (The boy and girl in the illustration looked like they were probably in that 5-12 year old range.)
2. Ca sul levtam.
3. Ca sul levtem wa levtam.
4. Fwici sul ya levte ya levtam.
5. Fwaca sul ya levtam wa ya levtem.
6. Fwaca sul ya levtam.
7. Sulishi ya tasem!
8. Sulishi ya valtem wa ya tasem. (The boy in the illustration looked like a teen to me.)
9. Pi def ya tase cakom.
10. Pi def ya valte cakom, pi seya?
11. Fwiki adad ya valte.
12. Fwiki adad ya tase, ki?
13. Fwipi sul ya tase ya valtem adadi.
14. Pa def cakom.
15. Pa def voyabenam.
16. Sulishi voyabenam laz!
17. Fwici sul voyabena, ci seya?
18. Fwaca sul voyabenam laz.
19. Pi def ya voyabena cakom, pi seya?
20. Pi def voyabena laz cakom. (Alternately, Pi def laz voyabena cakom. OR Pi def ya voyabena laz cakom.)
21. Pi def levta voyabenam wa cakom.
22. Fwiki lon ya levte, ki?
23. Fwiki lon wa adad ya levte.
24. Fwiki lon ya levte lonosham ulai.
25. Fwiki lon ya tase lonosham ulai, ki seya?
26. Fwipi sul ya tase ya levtem loni.
27. Fwipi weyat ya tase ya ulam, pi?
28. Fwipi weyat ya levte ya ulam.
That was fun. I might do more in a few more days. Or months. You know how it goes around here.
And a special request translation: Mi gan sanzomo laz go ambo-ambo. My canoe is very large.
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